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Discussion in 'Ontario Knife Company' started by OntarioKnifeCompany, Apr 29, 2015.

  1. knife chop

    knife chop

    816
    Feb 11, 2014
    Thanks Toooj,

    I've inquired about this in the past (See quote). Are plans on changing the grind to have a consistent straight edge?

     
  2. NCSlice

    NCSlice Gold Member Gold Member

    Feb 22, 2015
    I've been reading this thread for the first time today and never caught an actual answer for this.

    In my past research on the Forgcraft brand I found that way back when...many companies including OKC, Forgecraft (which became Washington forge or Olde Forge), Ekco Forge, and others, had upcycled old sawmill blades for their Knife steel. When steel was scarce they were able to get these cheap and abundant. The draw of the vintage knives are that these were from virgin carbon steel.

    The pattern is a design for less friction when cutting wood at the saw Mill. The indentations made less contact helping the saw Blade move through the wood and keeping it cooler as well.

    I read all this on the internet so it must be true!!! Maybe some folks in the industry can confirm this, but, it sounds legit lol.

    Now, the new stock...I dunno...I guess it would have to be made to look that way as I assume it's not upcycled mill blades these days.
     
  3. Toooj

    Toooj

    920
    Aug 8, 2006
    knife chop,

    The RTAKII was in design and production before my return so I can't answer as to why the pattern and grind was set up that way. I like small (or large) choils so the edge can be sharpened all the way to the grind shoulder. I can't make promises but maybe we can revise the pattern to have a choil added.

    NCSlice,

    You could be correct. However, there are so many "catch" points on the hammer pattern, I think that any minimizing of friction by less contact of the blade would be offset by the many sharp edges of the forged pattern catching the cut material. I believe that makes sense if you are talking about the Marbles knives with large fullers (blood grooves),the Kullenschliffs on some kitchen knives or the cutouts on cheese knives.
    I'll reach out to some of the "Old Timers" and see what they say......wait I am an Old Timer.
    There is a lot of "Stuff" that was done in the past that made perfect sense back then but the reasons have been lost to the ages. This may be one of them.

    Hope this helps.

    Best Regards,

    Paul Tsujimoto
    VP of Engineering
    Ontario Knife Company
     
  4. NCSlice

    NCSlice Gold Member Gold Member

    Feb 22, 2015
    Thanks for the reply, it would be nice to see an official answer, even if its not 100% positive. I have noticed that all the handles on various mfr's are smooth under the scales, no imprint. That always made me a bit curious of the whole "sawmill Blade" thing. Although I saw this in several places, there was probably one source that started it. It's been so long I can't reference where I saw it.
     
  5. LG&M

    LG&M

    Dec 19, 2005
    I would like to see the blackwind line brought back. I didn't get around to picking one up before they were discontinued and forgot about them. Now I want a Bengal . Ontario was a little ahead of curve when the blackwind 's were released, now I bet they would do well I also think one based on the USMC F/U would be very cool.

    Thanks for answering all our questions.
     
  6. afishhunter

    afishhunter

    Oct 21, 2014
    i thought the blade texture/pattern/embellishment, along with the handle was an early means of ID. No two brands had/have the same embellishment on the blade.
    For example, an Old Hickory and a Green River 6 inch "Buffalo Skinner" have the same blade shape and size, but a glance at the blades tells you which one is the Old Hickory and which is the Green River. Green River knives do not have the " old timey" blade embellishment like the Old Hickory knives do.
    (Actually, that is one of the reasons I like the Old Hickory line.)
     
  7. NCSlice

    NCSlice Gold Member Gold Member

    Feb 22, 2015
    The top is the oldest Forgecraft
    Next, a "newer" Forgecraft...
    They shut the doors in 1968 so these are at least 50 yrs old...

    Third is, of course, OKC,
    Last is Ekco Forge
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2016
  8. Boru13

    Boru13 Super Moderator Staff Member Super Mod Moderator

    Apr 25, 2000
    Toooj,
    I was curious as to why D2 steel was chosen for the pommel on the Chimera... was there any reason in particular ?

    Also is the crossguard on the Chimera D2 as well ?
     
  9. Toooj

    Toooj

    920
    Aug 8, 2006
    brboru7,

    The pommel of the Chimera is the same as the ASEK. That is machined from L-6. (according to the drawings) If it is D-2, I'll come back and correct myself. Tool steels provide more impact and deformation resistance than lower carbon steels.
    The guard is 1018/1020 Low carbon steel. Not so much need for additional properties in that area.
    Hope this helps.

    Best Regards,

    Paul Tsujimoto
    VP of Engineering
    Ontario Knife Company
     
  10. Boru13

    Boru13 Super Moderator Staff Member Super Mod Moderator

    Apr 25, 2000
    Thanks for the info Toooj, quite honestly I hope it is machined from L-6, using D2 steel for a butt cap seemed a little odd to me... but then again I'm not a engineer :D

    My information about it being D2 actually came from the OKC website, in the " Product Details " for the Chimera it is stated as having a " D2 steel glass breaking butt cap ".
     
  11. Toooj

    Toooj

    920
    Aug 8, 2006
    brboru,

    I'll have to investigate. We are trying to untrack and correct a lot of discrepancies in our systems...this is one of them.

    Thanks.

    Best Regards,

    Paul Tsujimoto
    VP of Engineering
    Ontario Knife Company
     
  12. h minus

    h minus

    88
    Dec 19, 2014
    Hello Toooj, I was wondering if you could please answer a quick question. It's no secret in this forum that I'm 1219C2 pattern lover. Got some Kabars and also Ontario's 498. The kabars handguard always stay solid, but on the Ontario's they all eventually loosen. I know that it doesn't affect the knife's safety or performance. Could you please tell me in your professional opinion or your best guess why this happens? Any tips on how to prevent/fix it? Thanks in advance!
     
  13. Toooj

    Toooj

    920
    Aug 8, 2006
    h minus,

    IMHO, the reason the Ontario guards loosen up is the amount of pressure that is put on the leather washers when the leather is stacked. KA-BAR uses a large hammer press that both presses and hammers the washers tight. Ontario just uses a hydraulic press. When the leather ages, it starts to shrink and the guard loosens. We (Ontario) need to put more pressure to the stack and add that one extra thin washer. Just for your information, the KA-BAR guards will also loosen but they have addressed the problem so it is not as prevalent. To tighten the guard, soak the entire leather handle in a container of warm neetsfoot oil and paraffin wax for a bout an hour or two. The leather will absorb the wax/oil combo and swell making the guard tight. After the wax/oil dries, wipe off the excess wax/oil. This is not a fool proof method and it is potentially flammable so use care. We will start to review the leather assembly process.
    Hope this helps.

    Best Regards,

    Paul Tsujimoto
    VP of Engineering
    Ontario Knife Company
     
  14. h minus

    h minus

    88
    Dec 19, 2014
    Yes it helps a lot Toooj. Please give us a heads up when OKC has resolved the hammer press and the extra leather washer issue with the 498. Thanks you sir!
     
  15. Wallaby7747

    Wallaby7747

    499
    Mar 21, 2012
    Hey Toooj, any info on which quarter the Dozier Arrow and the Carter Prime are going to drop?
     
  16. Toooj

    Toooj

    920
    Aug 8, 2006
    Wallaby,

    The Dozier Arrows are on the water as I speak. (meaning, pretty soon) The Carter Prime should be somewhere between Apr-June. Just in time for Blade Show.
    I'm sure Drew will give some ticklers along the way. Both were well received at SHOT and we hope you will like them also.
    Hope this helps.

    Best Regards,

    Paul Tsujimoto
    VP of Engineering
    Ontario Knife Company
     
  17. OntarioKnifeCompany

    OntarioKnifeCompany Moderator Moderator

    403
    Jan 3, 2013
    Here's a fun one about the Dozier Arrow - I went to the quality lab and weighed one. 81 grams. That's less than 3 ounces, and barely more than a jumbo egg from the grocery store.
     
  18. VoxDei Knives

    VoxDei Knives

    5
    Jan 11, 2016
    Hello, Toooj, and everyone @OKC

    I have been big supporter of OKC for some time now. And i love your stuff. My every day carry is a RAT3, and i love it so much i purchased a second one with a serrated edge, and recently got the assisted RAT 1, and love that as well. I use the hell out of my two fixed blades, and they are my fav in my collection. I also have OKC Ranger series Falcon,Love it!, a cold steel Voyager fully serrated tanto tip, Esee 4 (i know thats a curse word,sorry) and a few Schrade fixed blades SCHF11,12,33,36 , tactical and survival,Old school USMC Ka-Bar,and a Becker BK2, but as i said my my RAT3 is my favorite, it has more character than any knife i have ever had. And its been inspirational, and so has your company, and i recently decided im going to make my own blades as well.
    Now that ive kissed proper amounts of toes and asses, i am responding to the comment about "small runs of current models with changes in material"
    Guys i missed out on the Limited edition RAT 3 in D2 tool steel, and the black G10 or black micarta. Id love to get my hands on one, or maybe even a Ltd RAT3 in 5160 or some high tech stainless. Its your choice. I love the molded sheath for the rat3, and i wish the OKC Falcon come standard with this also, or a leather scout style horizontal carry style sheath for either one. If any of these ideas sound good, and are produced, i will be sure to get in on that.

    Thank you guys
    VoxDei
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2016
  19. Toooj

    Toooj

    920
    Aug 8, 2006
    VoxDei,

    Thanks for your support for OKC Knives....and knives in general. I can't tell you for sure what lies in the future. Product Development is a mixture of guessing and serendipity surrounded by charts, graphs and spreadsheets.
    You threw your thoughts on the wall. Wait and see what sticks. I do like short run LTD Ed knives.

    Best Regards,

    Paul Tsujimoto
    VP of Engineering
    Ontario Knife Comapny
     
  20. ml100

    ml100

    747
    Jul 19, 2005
    Hello Toooj,
    i just realized that the hardness indicated on the OKC Website for the Ontario ASEK has changed form 50-54 to 55-57.
    When did that change take place? Or is there an error on the website?
    best regards,
    Markus
     

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